There they were -- Penn State coach Joe Battista and Iowa State coach Al Murdoch -- chatting under the desert sun in Tempe, Ariz., this past weekend. The temperature hovered around 80 degrees, the sun shined bright. A penguin couldn't picture ice if it tried.

But these two longtime friends and competitors, with more than 1,300 coaching victories between them, had, of course, only one thing on their minds. Hockey, the game to which they have devoted two lifetimes.

This game had brought them to Arizona for the four-day Desert Classic hosted by Arizona State University, during which Battista's No. 4-ranked Icers faced Murdoch's No. 5-ranked Cyclones.

The conversation the two were having was not any attempt to further scout the opponent. After 25 years of knowing each other and 15 years of American Collegiate Hockey Association (ACHA) games, what strategies could possibly be unknown? Instead, the two discussed ideas that they felt could improve the future of college hockey and the obstacles of getting their programs to Division I varsity status.

Fifteen years earlier, the conversation was the same, but the location was different. After a 1991 postseason tournament that nearly did not include one-loss North Dakota State, a team that had won five of the previous six club hockey championships, Battista and Murdoch were the leaders among a group of 15 coaches that saw the need to legitimize non-varsity hockey.

With pressure from Battista, Murdoch and a few other coaches, North Dakota State was entered into the '91 tournament as the No. 8 seed. They went on to win the championship. But Battista and Murdoch felt the internal squabbling and general disorganization of club hockey had run its course. How could the best club team in the country be so close to not playing in the national tournament, Battista thought at the time.

Inside the North Shore Hilton in Skokie, Ill., during the immediate coaches meeting following that tournament, Murdoch, Battista and Tom Keegan, who would become the ACHA's first executive director, made a presentation supporting the creation of a better club hockey organization. On April 20, 1991, the ACHA was formed with Murdoch serving as its first president. Two years later, Battista became its second.

"Up until 1991, there were no real rules," Battista said. "Graduate students played, part-time students played, non-degree students played. We would play Ohio and they would have seven or eight guys that had already gone through their eligibility in junior 'A' hockey in Canada and came back as grad students. They had a guy who was 28 years old playing for them. He had already played juniors and had already played undergrad for them."

New eligibility requirements were approved among other new standards. Only full-time students who maintained a 2.0 grade point average while carrying 12 credits a semester would be allowed to play ACHA hockey.

Murdoch's Iowa State team won the inaugural ACHA national tournament, hosted by Penn State in 1992. The trophy awarded to the Cyclones for their efforts was none other than the Murdoch Cup, now given to the ACHA champion annually.

"Usually you have to die to get your name on something like that," Murdoch said, laughing.

But the name on the cup, according to Battista, who nearly accepted an offer in 1986 to be Murdoch's assistant coach at Iowa State, honors the undying passion that Murdoch has for the game of hockey and the precedent that he has set for club programs to follow, including Penn State's.

"He has been the pioneer. We've all kind of learned from him in one way or another," Battista said, adding that Penn State and Iowa State's programs are very similar in regards to fundraising, educational values and getting their players involved in the community.

The meeting forming the ACHA -- which now has more than 300 programs, three men's divisions and one women's division -- was not the last nor the only time the two would collaborate. Starting in 2001, USA Hockey made the decision to make its biennial World University Games team up of solely of ACHA players. For the 2003 games held in Italy Murdoch was the team's general manager and called upon Battista to be its head coach.

"The fact that the ACHA sends a team is Al's doing. He's the one that drove that," Battista said.

Throughout the tournament, Murdoch would take time to educate the roster of players which included Murdoch's son, Andrew.

"We listened every day at breakfast to 'Big Al's Story Time,' the guys called it. He'd get up and relate some story about the country we were in and the team we're playing," Battista said. "He's an educator. Al is first and foremost and educator."

"Great education," Murdoch, a Ph.D, said of the ACHA. "That's the biggest thing we sell."

Murdoch and Battista are currently writing chapters for a book titled, "The Hockey Coaches Bible," that is planned to feature chapters from 31 of the most respected hockey coaches in America. Legendary Boston University coach Jack Parker is penning a chapter on defensive skills.

"Skills for Forwards" is being written by Michigan State coach Rick Comley. While those coaches are focusing on on-ice skills, Battista's chapter, tentatively titled "Marketing and Fundraising Effectively," and Murdoch's, "Building A School-Based Program," reflect the off-ice hurdles facing non-varsity hockey teams today.

It was these topics that Battista, now with 502 career victories, and Murdoch, with 839 wins, talked about in the desert southwest. The presence of hockey in Arizona is already a sign of hockey's growth, but these two pioneers will continue looking to the future as they have done so many times in the past.

"We kind of teased each other," Battista said. "What else would we do if we weren't doing this?"